L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air force
- Mirage F1
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
الاخ العزيز حيدر قصدت بشركة لوكهيد مارتن و السرعة فوق الصوتية لطائرة الـT-50 و الف الف شكر لمرورك
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- Field Marshal - Muheeb
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
I am disappointed that Iraq is buying the l159. I was hoping for the t50, it has so much more potential for dual use as an interceptor and attack aircraft.
- Mirage F1
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
اخ حيدر استغرب لتفكير قيادات القوات المسلحة العراقية فهم دائماً يبحثون عن الصفقات المتخلفة من الناحية التقنية و يبحثون في دول ليست بالمتصدرة في التقانة العسكرية مثل الجيك و بولندا و اوكرانيا على الاسلحة مع العلم الدول المتقدمة مثل فرنسا و بريطانيا و روسيا تطمح ان تكون السباقة في تجهيز الاسلحة الى العراق
مثال على كلامي تباحث العراق مع كوريا منذ عام 2008 على تجهيز الـT-50 و اصبح الموضوع مع الوقت في حكم المنسي مع العلم دول مثل الامارات تقوم الان بتقييم الT-50 لتجهيز قوتها الجوية بها وذلك لمواصفاتها المتقدمة و نفس الحالة بالنسبة لطائرة الـLasta فهي ذات مواصفات محدودة مع العلم وجود الـPC-21 في الاسواق وهي ذات مواصفات رائعة و غيرها من الامثلة العديدة
مثال على كلامي تباحث العراق مع كوريا منذ عام 2008 على تجهيز الـT-50 و اصبح الموضوع مع الوقت في حكم المنسي مع العلم دول مثل الامارات تقوم الان بتقييم الT-50 لتجهيز قوتها الجوية بها وذلك لمواصفاتها المتقدمة و نفس الحالة بالنسبة لطائرة الـLasta فهي ذات مواصفات محدودة مع العلم وجود الـPC-21 في الاسواق وهي ذات مواصفات رائعة و غيرها من الامثلة العديدة
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- Field Marshal - Muheeb
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
One important variable that we have t bear in mind, is that Iraq bought these weapons from Serbia, Czech, Poland as part of the deal to write off Iraq's debts! Let us hope that we will see better decisions made with the fighter aircraft. I hoe that they do not buy the downgraded f16s and go for French and Russian aircraft (rafale and su35).... We can only dream.
- TangoIII
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
أندونيسيا بالامس وقعت عقدا مع كوريا الجنوبية لشراء 19 مقاتلة تي-50 بكلفة كلية قدرها 400 مليون دولار والتسليم في نهاية عام 2013 وبحسبة بسيطة فأن السعر هو25 مليون دولار للطائرة الجديدة بالكامل والسؤال ماهو سعر الطائرة الجيكية التي سيتعاقد عليها العراق وهي مخزنة منذ نحو عقد من الزمان ؟
Aerospace Industries agreed with Indonesiaí»s Defense Ministry to sell 16 T-50 Golden Eagle jets in the $400 million deal. The aircraft will be delivered by the end of 2013, according to the agreement.
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/ ... id=2936726
- التوبوليف العراقية
- Lieutenant Colonel - Muqqadam
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
Mirage F1 كتب:اخ حيدر استغرب لتفكير قيادات القوات المسلحة العراقية فهم دائماً يبحثون عن الصفقات المتخلفة من الناحية التقنية و يبحثون في دول ليست بالمتصدرة في التقانة العسكرية مثل الجيك و بولندا و اوكرانيا على الاسلحة مع العلم الدول المتقدمة مثل فرنسا و بريطانيا و روسيا تطمح ان تكون السباقة في تجهيز الاسلحة الى العراق
مثال على كلامي تباحث العراق مع كوريا منذ عام 2008 على تجهيز الـT-50 و اصبح الموضوع مع الوقت في حكم المنسي مع العلم دول مثل الامارات تقوم الان بتقييم الT-50 لتجهيز قوتها الجوية بها وذلك لمواصفاتها المتقدمة و نفس الحالة بالنسبة لطائرة الـLasta فهي ذات مواصفات محدودة مع العلم وجود الـPC-21 في الاسواق وهي ذات مواصفات رائعة و غيرها من الامثلة العديدة
جوابي لك اخ ميراج :
اعتقد ان السياسة تتدخل بشكل مباشر احيانا في مشتريات وتعاقدات العراق العسكرية وان القيادة العسكرية في العراق بين مطرقة وسندان فمن جهة لايمكن لهم صرف الاموال على شراء الاسلحة بسهولة كما في السابق( في السبعينات والثمانينات ) بسبب الفشل الادراري والانقسام داخل مجلس النواب ( تصور عام 2008 عادل عبد المهدي يصرح امام وكالات الاخبار العالمية عندما اراد العراق شراء اسلحة ثقيلة وعقد صفقة بقيمة 11 مليار دولار فقال : نحن لا نريد جيشا كبيرا يقوم بعمل انقلابات عسكرية علينة ؟؟!! ) واعترضت في حينها اسرائيل والكويت كما ان الاكراد اعترضوا ومن جهة اخرى وبصراحة اسرائيل وامريكا لاتريد بناء جيش حديث وقوي للعراق
فهي لاتنسى ابدا ان اول من وصل الى تل ابيب هو الطيار العراقي ..
انا اسف على هذا الرد الذي قد نخرج به عن الموضوع الرئيسي
المعرفة تسبق النصر، والجهل يسبق الهزيمة
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- Field Marshal - Muheeb
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
something new....
Iraq to receive T-50s through South Korean countertrade
Jon Grevatt Jane's Asia-Pacific Industry Reporter
Bangkok
South Korean defence officials have indicated that they are prepared to accept an offer from Iraq to purchase the Korea Aerospace Industries (KAI) T-50 Golden Eagle advanced jet trainer (AJT) through the countertrade of crude oil.
In a briefing to the South Korean National Assembly, which was submitted on 14 June, the Defence Acquisition Program Administration (DAPA) said it was willing to be flexible on payment terms for the aircraft in negotiations with Iraqi officials planned for next month.
The deal over crude oil would likely suit both parties. According to the US Energy Information Administration, Iraq is the world's 12th largest oil producer, while South Korea is the world's fifth largest importer of oil. South Korea has no indigenous crude oil production and is completely dependent on imports.
The DAPA report added that meetings about the T-50 will be held to discuss the price of the aircraft and other details related to the potential deal. Iraq is expected to procure up to 24 AJTs at an estimated cost of USD600 million. Other contenders for the Iraq AJT contest are believed to be the BAE Systems Hawk, the Czech Republic's Aero Vodochody L-159 and the Italian Alenia Aermacchi M-346.
The procured trainers would support Iraq's planned purchased of Lockheed Martin F-16 Block 52 Fighting Falcon aircraft. Iraq requested to purchase 18 F-16s from the United States in September 2010, although the Iraqi Air Force is still believed to have a long-term requirement for up to 100 F-16 aircraft. The T-50 could be regarded as a leading candidate due to Lockheed Martin's co-development of the trainer under an offset deal attached to South Korea's purchase of F-16s in the 1990s.
DAPA's willingness to be flexible with payment terms on the potential T-50 sale could strengthen its bid. In the past Seoul has sold military equipment to Indonesia in exchange for CN-235 medium-range transport aircraft built by PT Dirgantara, and it is known to have considered similar deals, also with Indonesia, in a bid to secure sales of submarines and the T-50. Indonesia recently agreed to purchase 16 T-50s for USD400 million, although the financial package for this deal is still being finalised.
Iraq to receive T-50s through South Korean countertrade
Jon Grevatt Jane's Asia-Pacific Industry Reporter
Bangkok
South Korean defence officials have indicated that they are prepared to accept an offer from Iraq to purchase the Korea Aerospace Industries (KAI) T-50 Golden Eagle advanced jet trainer (AJT) through the countertrade of crude oil.
In a briefing to the South Korean National Assembly, which was submitted on 14 June, the Defence Acquisition Program Administration (DAPA) said it was willing to be flexible on payment terms for the aircraft in negotiations with Iraqi officials planned for next month.
The deal over crude oil would likely suit both parties. According to the US Energy Information Administration, Iraq is the world's 12th largest oil producer, while South Korea is the world's fifth largest importer of oil. South Korea has no indigenous crude oil production and is completely dependent on imports.
The DAPA report added that meetings about the T-50 will be held to discuss the price of the aircraft and other details related to the potential deal. Iraq is expected to procure up to 24 AJTs at an estimated cost of USD600 million. Other contenders for the Iraq AJT contest are believed to be the BAE Systems Hawk, the Czech Republic's Aero Vodochody L-159 and the Italian Alenia Aermacchi M-346.
The procured trainers would support Iraq's planned purchased of Lockheed Martin F-16 Block 52 Fighting Falcon aircraft. Iraq requested to purchase 18 F-16s from the United States in September 2010, although the Iraqi Air Force is still believed to have a long-term requirement for up to 100 F-16 aircraft. The T-50 could be regarded as a leading candidate due to Lockheed Martin's co-development of the trainer under an offset deal attached to South Korea's purchase of F-16s in the 1990s.
DAPA's willingness to be flexible with payment terms on the potential T-50 sale could strengthen its bid. In the past Seoul has sold military equipment to Indonesia in exchange for CN-235 medium-range transport aircraft built by PT Dirgantara, and it is known to have considered similar deals, also with Indonesia, in a bid to secure sales of submarines and the T-50. Indonesia recently agreed to purchase 16 T-50s for USD400 million, although the financial package for this deal is still being finalised.
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- Field Marshal - Muheeb
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
I really hope Iraq does go for the T50s! I guess the czechs were too expensive!
Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
Hallo from Czech Republic,
I found this forum thru google search. I'd like to know how Iraq people see this contract. With accordance today unofficial information, Aero want to buy back 24pcs of L159A from Czech Army and sell it to Iraq.
L159 was made in the number of 72 pieces. One of them crashed pilot mistake in flight validation of Czech cannon pods Plamen "Flame" (loping at low altitude, pilot died)
Plamen photo at L159A
http://forum.valka.cz/files/next_011_273.jpg
The army was reduced number of machines in operation on the 24th. Some L159A were converted into two-seat training version without radar called L159T1. Aero offer two-seat training verson with radar called L-159B. 36 pieces of L-159A for several years stored directly at the producer. 24 pcs from 36 stored are offer to your air force.
Photo stored aircrafts
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1103098/l ... hody-lkvo/
The aircraft are packed into four-layer film in which a protective atmosphere of dry nitrogen and moisture absorbers are added. Status protective atmosphere (Humidity, temperature) is monitored by a recording device.
I found this forum thru google search. I'd like to know how Iraq people see this contract. With accordance today unofficial information, Aero want to buy back 24pcs of L159A from Czech Army and sell it to Iraq.
L159 was made in the number of 72 pieces. One of them crashed pilot mistake in flight validation of Czech cannon pods Plamen "Flame" (loping at low altitude, pilot died)
Plamen photo at L159A
http://forum.valka.cz/files/next_011_273.jpg
The army was reduced number of machines in operation on the 24th. Some L159A were converted into two-seat training version without radar called L159T1. Aero offer two-seat training verson with radar called L-159B. 36 pieces of L-159A for several years stored directly at the producer. 24 pcs from 36 stored are offer to your air force.
Photo stored aircrafts
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1103098/l ... hody-lkvo/
The aircraft are packed into four-layer film in which a protective atmosphere of dry nitrogen and moisture absorbers are added. Status protective atmosphere (Humidity, temperature) is monitored by a recording device.
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- Field Marshal - Muheeb
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
Hi cejkis welcome to the forum.
With regards to the choice of lift aircraft for iraq, i am personally in favour of buying the korean T50 as it offers better long term potential, more modern supersonic capable design with wider scope for limited armed use than the vulnerable subsonic L159 (or for that matter m346 or hawk).
Iraq was a previous operator of the L39, which meand it will be easier to induct the L159 into service, but i think if korea accepts iraqs proposal, then we should go for the T50, which also is being built now with a dedicated attack variant the a50 that iraq could potentially use too in the future...
With regards to the choice of lift aircraft for iraq, i am personally in favour of buying the korean T50 as it offers better long term potential, more modern supersonic capable design with wider scope for limited armed use than the vulnerable subsonic L159 (or for that matter m346 or hawk).
Iraq was a previous operator of the L39, which meand it will be easier to induct the L159 into service, but i think if korea accepts iraqs proposal, then we should go for the T50, which also is being built now with a dedicated attack variant the a50 that iraq could potentially use too in the future...
Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
Hi Hayder,hayder كتب:Hi cejkis welcome to the forum.
With regards to the choice of lift aircraft for iraq, i am personally in favour of buying the korean T50 as it offers better long term potential, more modern supersonic capable design with wider scope for limited armed use than the vulnerable subsonic L159 (or for that matter m346 or hawk).
Iraq was a previous operator of the L39, which meand it will be easier to induct the L159 into service, but i think if korea accepts iraqs proposal, then we should go for the T50, which also is being built now with a dedicated attack variant the a50 that iraq could potentially use too in the future...
Korean T50 is completely different machine, whose design is based on the F16. Its users a far greater combat potential. L159A is a machine designed for training with a much smaller value than the T50.
If the Iraqi army will decide without influence finance surely win the T50. However, if Aero offers an interesting price, it is necessary to consider the pros and cons.
My recommendation for Iraq is a combination of upgraded A10 with a new wing, then F16 or equivalent, training planes of any production.
A10 has no real compensation except Russian Su39
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- Field Marshal - Muheeb
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
For iraq, short term cash is a problem. So the winner is ghe one who gives the best payment plan (as income from oil is steadily increasing year by year).
One other point for iraq is political. Korea is the single biggest non-oil investor in iraq (just in the first six months of 2011 korea invested over 22bn usd in iraqi realestate, factories etc....). So even if the t50 proves expensive, iraq may be obliged to buy it as a sop to the biggest economic investor in iraq!
I see no chance for the m346 or hawk, and the l159 is maybe number 2 in the race based on priceand delivery ability.
One other point for iraq is political. Korea is the single biggest non-oil investor in iraq (just in the first six months of 2011 korea invested over 22bn usd in iraqi realestate, factories etc....). So even if the t50 proves expensive, iraq may be obliged to buy it as a sop to the biggest economic investor in iraq!
I see no chance for the m346 or hawk, and the l159 is maybe number 2 in the race based on priceand delivery ability.
- TangoIII
- Lieutenant Colonel - Muqqadam
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Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
Aero Vodochody boss optimistic about Iraq L-159 decision
Iraq is understood to be close to a deal to buy about 24 surplus L-159 light combat aircraft from the Czech Republic.
Ladislav Simek, chief executive of Czech aerostructures specialist Aero Vodochody, which built 72 L-159s for the country's air force a decade ago, said he is "quite optimistic" about an imminent agreement from Baghdad. "It is a long process, but we hope to finalise this year," he said.
Aero Vodochody has been responsible for maintaining and, in co-operation with the Czech government, trying to find new homes for surplus L-159s since part of the fleet was furloughed, largely unflown in active service, in 2005.
Speaking at the MAKS air show in Moscow, Simek said he also believes there is "a good chance" of selling the L-159 to Poland. Warsaw is seeking 16 lead-in fighter trainer and light-attack aircraft, with the Alenia Aermacchi M-346 and Korea Aerospace Industries/Lockheed Martin T-50 also in contention.
Prague held on to 24 of its Honeywell F124-100-powered aircraft, including four two-seat T1 examples, which it now operates alongside 14 Saab Gripen C/Ds.
Since building the L-159s, Aero Vodochody has been repositioning itself away from a vertically-integrated airframer towards aerostructures, and being a risk-sharing partner on a number of civil and military programmes with Alenia Aeronautica, Boeing, Bombardier and Sikorsky.
Earlier this year it signed a deal with Embraer to design and manufacture the fixed leading edge on the Brazilian company's KC-390 transport/tanker.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20 ... ision.html
Iraq is understood to be close to a deal to buy about 24 surplus L-159 light combat aircraft from the Czech Republic.
Ladislav Simek, chief executive of Czech aerostructures specialist Aero Vodochody, which built 72 L-159s for the country's air force a decade ago, said he is "quite optimistic" about an imminent agreement from Baghdad. "It is a long process, but we hope to finalise this year," he said.
Aero Vodochody has been responsible for maintaining and, in co-operation with the Czech government, trying to find new homes for surplus L-159s since part of the fleet was furloughed, largely unflown in active service, in 2005.
Speaking at the MAKS air show in Moscow, Simek said he also believes there is "a good chance" of selling the L-159 to Poland. Warsaw is seeking 16 lead-in fighter trainer and light-attack aircraft, with the Alenia Aermacchi M-346 and Korea Aerospace Industries/Lockheed Martin T-50 also in contention.
Prague held on to 24 of its Honeywell F124-100-powered aircraft, including four two-seat T1 examples, which it now operates alongside 14 Saab Gripen C/Ds.
Since building the L-159s, Aero Vodochody has been repositioning itself away from a vertically-integrated airframer towards aerostructures, and being a risk-sharing partner on a number of civil and military programmes with Alenia Aeronautica, Boeing, Bombardier and Sikorsky.
Earlier this year it signed a deal with Embraer to design and manufacture the fixed leading edge on the Brazilian company's KC-390 transport/tanker.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20 ... ision.html
Re: L159 / T50 / Hawk T2 / M346 competition for Iraqi air fo
Czech government offered L159 payment thru oil delivery with accordance the czech media